Eliza, Catharine and William Riley

[Norfolk Nan]

Just wanted to say a big thank you to everyone who has contributed to this thread over the weekend. Your ideas and links have helped me sort out a bit of a muddle. I have a working theory, four certificates on order and a stack of newspaper reports that not only add more texture to the family gossip but provided useful new information. I may have got there eventually left to my own devices but fresh eyes and different thinking is always very useful!

Thank you.

[Norfolk Nan]

As suggested by Avaline I’m back here with the update. Death certs confirmed Eliza’s death in 1894, but I’m still wondering where she was in 1891.

Peter Riley’s death certificate confirmed the details given in the burial register but nothing else. There was no sign of a wife or other relative. He was an army pensioner and his address was Caroline Street. As Eliza only appears with children in the 1871 census I can’t be sure there is a connection. He was unmarried in 1850 when he left the army and I’ve yet to be sure where he or Eliza, together or apart, in 1851 and 1861. I still can’t find a marriage cert for the couple or a birth cert for William but I’m waiting for a birth cert for Caroline. Fingers crossed. I need one thing to link them pre 1870.

[avaline]

Per my earlier post, in 1851 Peter is at Victoria Yard, Turks Row, Chelsea - HO107/1472/461/43, transcribed on FmP as Reley:
Peter Riley 40 Unmarried Chelsea Pensioner b Dublin

[Norfolk Nan]

I saw Turks Row mentioned in old newspaper reports yesterday, totally unconnected to anyone in my tree fortunately.

I haven’t forgotten about him but I still can’t link him with Eliza at that point. He’s unmarried, Catherine is born c1852 but I’ve no idea if he’s her father as well as Williams. Or if he married Eliza or stayed single - would a new wife have compromised his army pensioner status? I’ve yet to find Peter in a document with one of the Riley’s. William always talks about him as deceased. Catherine never refers to him. I just need something to provide a true link.

[avaline]

I can't find an absolute link either, but I believe that there are poor law records at Westminster Archives (rather than the LMA) that haven't been released online yet, and these might provide something helpful.

As to William Riley, I think he was born nearer 1854-5 than 1856, and that this might be his birth registration, although if so, there'll be no mention of Peter Riley: EDWARDS, WILLIAM (no mmn) GRO Reference: 1854 S Quarter in MARYLEBONE Volume 01A Page 343

Age/YoB from the census (I think I've got the right ones!)
1871: 17 (c1854)
1881: 25 (c1856)
1881 marriage: 26 (c1855)
1891: 36 (c1855)
1901: 48 (c1853)
1911: 58 (c1853)

[Norfolk Nan]

Hi Avaline

Your census ages line up with what I have so I think you are on the right track. I guess the only way I'll find out is to get the certificate!

It's interesting that he hangs onto the Riley as though he has some physical connection to Peter Riley. The soldier is the closest I've come to identifying a person but wouldn't it be useful if there was a bit of paper that really did link them! The weird thing is that Catherine and her daughter both name their father as Peter Edwards. And no one names a child Peter despite there being plenty of them.

Thank you

[Norfolk Nan]

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!!!!

Evidence at last. Peter Riley, army pensioner, died on 5 February 1870 at 15 Caroline Street, Pimlico. On 24th February Caroline Edwards gives birth to a daughter, Caroline, in the Mount Street Workhouse Infirmary and the birth certificate states mother's home address at 15 Caroline Street, Pimlico!!

Further, Caroline Edwards herself was born in 23 July 1852 at the Isleworth Union Workhouse, Brentford. Her mother is Eliza Elizabeth Edwards, no father recorded. No other address shown. That suggests to me that she isn't Peter Riley's child. I need to do some further digging about in workhouse records...

Thank you Avaline, Mo and others - such great researchers!

[VALLMO9]

On 24th February Caroline Edwards gives birth to a daughter, Caroline, in the Mount Street Workhouse Infirmary and the birth certificate states mother's home address at 15 Caroline Street, Pimlico!!
Further, Caroline Edwards herself was born in 23 July 1852 at the Isleworth Union Workhouse, Brentford.

Great news! But don't you mean Catherine Edwards (not Caroline)? I just knew her Turnham Green birthplace on the two census records was significant. Given that a neighbour registered Peter's 1870 death, you may want to consider that 15 Caroline Street was a lodging house.

[Norfolk Nan]

Ooops! Yes Catherine, not Caroline! Now I just need to see if there’s any info about Isleworth.

[VALLMO9]

Playing Devil's advocate: if 15 Caroline Street was a lodging house, then it might be the Edwards family rubbed shoulders with Peter Riley. And that's the only connection. Perhaps his name and "army pensioner" status lended itself well to an illegitimate birth registration.