Finding a birth

[PatsyAlice]

I have a death certificate for an Oliver John Dalziel who died in Jan 1977. It states he was born 16 May 1915 in Acton, Ealing. However, I cannot find a relevant birth for this time. I wondered if anyone had any suggestions to help me.

[Mick Loney]

This would be the details provided by the informant, so third hand at best.You need to ask yourself how well did they know Oliver? Perhaps they knew he came from there, and so assumed he was born there.

Try to find him in 1921 census, this states quite a precise birthplace, especially for Irish ancestors. I knew my Great-Grandmother came from Cork area, but it wasn't until I saw her 1921 entry, did I discover she actually came from the Parish of Skibbereen.

Also, You may find his birth wasn't registered at all! My grandfather being a good example

[PatsyAlice]

I have looked on the 1921 census but not found him. I have looked in 1939 and not found him either although I appreciate that that does not necessarily mean anything.

[Norfolk Nan]

Sorry, I’ve just posted a long list of info about your chap who seems to have been born, baptised, mentioned in Army records for his father and married as Oliver John Razey. All the details match. Mothers maiden name Frost. Unfortunately I hit post and it disappeared. Try Razey on ancestry …

[Mick Loney]

Just did a search on ancestry as Norfolk Nan suggested and top of the list of results is a baptism for him in Acton on 20 Jun 1915 (with image) with a birthdate of 16 May 1915, with his twin brother Arthur William Razey.

You now have another problem, finding out how his surname changed from Razey to Dalziel

[PatsyAlice]

Thank you both. I now have a slight confession to make. I came at this from the other direction - trying to discover what happened to Oliver John Razey. The only death I could find was for the Dalziel man and when I sent for the certificate and saw he had been born in Acton I was convinced they were one and the same person but I wanted to see if anyone else made that connection or if I was being fanciful. Oliver John Razey is last seen in 1946 in Acton on the electoral roll (although the name is not quite right) and I have not found anything for Oliver John Dalziel until he dies in Aylesbury. His death is reported by an Annie Bella Dalziel whose death is then registered as Annabella Dalziel in 1985 in North Bucks. I am doing this to try and help someone so I don't want to throw lots of money at it but it is driving me mad and I don't know how to find out more. I have looked at newspapers, I can't find a marriage - I did wonder if he took the name Dalziel because it was 'Annabella's' name but I can't find anything of her either. The whole thing seems to be a complete mystery. I have even found his telephone number as J. Dalziel in Bletchley. I have long periods where I don't think about it and then something starts me off again!

[Norfolk Nan]

Any idea what happened to his first wife, Florence? They married in 1935. That might provide a clue. What happened to his many siblings? I wondered if his father had died and his mother married again (or didn’t) and the whole family took on the stepdad’s name? Things to think about…

Amended…

It seems first wife Florence remarried in 1948 suggesting they had divorced but that needs to be confirmed.

[PatsyAlice]

They split up - I don't know if they divorced. I don't know where I would look for that. She 'married' someone else. He had a twin brother but no clues there. I looked to see if there was a newspaper report for his mother's funeral in case it mentioned him. The friend I am helping has put the Razey details on Ancestry and made contact with some relatives but nobody knows what happened to OJ. The only thing I can think is that he didn't divorce the wife and moved away and changed his name. It is baffling. Also I can't find anything about Annabella. I did wonder whether I should have one last throw and get her death cert to see who reported her death. At first I thought it would be quite easy as Razey is not that common (although more common than I thought) Surely Annabella should be on the 1939 but, again, it is a name that could be entered in various ways and not knowing where she came from doesn't help although it gives the birth date in the death record. I have no experience with people who have changed their name.

[Norfolk Nan]

She definitely remarried in 1948 in Ealing to chap called Dodson. Her maiden name was Middleton and if they divorced there should be a second marriage entry using Middleton. And there is, so you can be sure there was a divorce.

The Razeys are living in Eaton with his mother Annie and one blacked out name in 1939.

[PatsyAlice]

Can you tell me where you look for a divorce?